Bibleline Radio Show – 2006-09-22 – Christ Plus Equals Nothing

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Welcome to Bibleline with Dr. Hank Lindstrom. Coming to you from Calvary Community Church in Tampa, Florida, declaring God’s love through radio and television, providing real answers to an ever-searching world. Got a question? Dial toll free at 1-800-576-3771. That’s 1-800-576-3771. Now here’s the host of Bibleline, Dr. Hank Lindstrom. Good morning and welcome to Bibleline great to be with you today. Thanks for tuning in to the broadcast. We’re coming to you live from Tampa, Florida, from our studios here at the Calvary Community Church where I’m the pastor.

And we’re coming to you every day, Monday through Friday live and in the Tampa Bay area we’re on seven days a week as we play the best of on the weekends. And we hope that you’ll take advantage and listen as often as you can. And if you can’t always catch it during the time of the live broadcast, you can always go to the internet and you can catch us 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Just go to BibleLineMinistries.org or .com, click on that little TV set in the upper right hand corner of the home page and you’ll be connected with a page on the left side that will say Bible on television, on the right side Bible on radio and you can click and watch our television programs and listen to our radio programs from anywhere in the world 24 hours a day, any day, any time of day, and

I hope you’ll take advantage. Good to be with you. We have that Tuesday class coming up again, this coming Tuesday 7 to 9. Love to have you in the classroom, and I hope you’ll make every effort to come. If you’re not in the area, you can of course order the CDs and get this series by CD, 10 hours of teaching on meeting the challenge. An exciting class about the challenge of the Christian life and this ought to lift you up several notches in your growth as a believer.

This is a good class and I think you’ll enjoy it and if you can come and be in person in the classroom that would be wonderful. Don’t forget that we have our television programs on every Thursday and yesterday we were on the dish network, we were on DirecTV on more television and on CTN and maybe you caught some of our programs. But if you missed them you can go to the internet and click on the little TV set in the upper right hand corner and you’ll be connected to the program of the week and you can go back in our archives and catch past television programs.

We’re going to go to the phone lines and then we’ll take our callers and we have already people waiting to get up on the air and we’ll catch them as soon as we can. We’re going to take a look at some interesting verses. You know the Bible gives a formula, grace plus works equals no salvation. That’s right, Christ plus works equals no salvation. You don’t want to be in that category where you’re trusting in Christ plus works because the result will be zero.

In Galatians 5 it says here in verse 4, Christ is become of no effect unto you. Whosoever of you are justified by the law, you are fallen from grace. Would you like to stand before God and have Christ count nothing for you? Well if you add any works to salvation, then Christ will count nothing for you because you You have fallen from grace. What you have done is rejected God’s offer of mercy, of salvation, by unmerited favor, which is grace.

And you’re attempting to do something of self to save yourself and therefore Christ will count nothing for you. Notice it says here in Galatians 5.4, Christ has become of no effect unto you, and then it identifies, to whom it is speaking, whose whoever of you that are justified by the law. If you are attempting to be justified by the law or by works or by keeping the commandments, then Christ will be of no effect for you. Then obviously you’ll not make heaven.

It says in verse 2 of Galatians chapter 5, behold I, Paul, say unto you that if you be circumcised, and by the way that’s a term that really refers to those that are keeping the law. 1 Corinthians 7, 19 says circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the keeping of the commandments of the law. And so those that were called the circumcised were the lawkeepers and those that were called the uncircumcised were called those that were not lawkeepers.

And so if you are circumcised or you’re keeping the law, Christ shall profit you nothing. I’m quoting the Bible. Galatians 5, 2 says Christ shall profit you nothing. Verse 4 says, Christ has become of no effect unto you. Whosoever of you are justified by the law. You are fallen from grace. Now you cannot fall from salvation, but you can fall from grace. Did you know there is a difference? In Titus 2.11 it says, The grace of God that bringeth salvation has appeared to all men.

Let me quote that again. Titus 2, 11 says the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men. So we know that grace is the means by which salvation is brought to you. It’s brought to you by grace, by mercy, on merit and favor. And it’s likely water pipe brings water into your home. But when you’re thirsty, you don’t bite down on the water pipe. You simply turn the tap and the water flows through the water pipe.

Faith is what turns the tap. When you put your trust in Jesus Christ, grace then brings salvation. It flows. And grace is the conduit through which salvation is brought to you when you turn the tap by placing your faith in Jesus Christ as Savior. As long as you’re adding any works to that, the formula is Christ plus works equals no salvation. Let me just put it this way, Christ plus tenants equals no salvation, Christ plus confirmation equals no salvation, Christ plus confirmation equals no salvation, Christ plus water baptism equals no salvation, Christ plus living the Christian life equals no salvation, Christ plus works equals no salvation.

In other words, grace is the means of which we are saved. Grace brings salvation according to Titus 2.11. And if you reject the grace by which we are saved, then you have fallen from grace according to Galatians 5.4 and you are not saved. It’s interesting here in Galatians 5.4 and 5 that verse 4 is talking to the unsaved And you’ll notice it addresses the unsaved as you, you, you, you, you, you. Christ has become of no effect unto you.

Whosoever of you are justified by the law. You are followed from grace. Verse 5 switches to the believers and says, we, we, we, we, we, we. We in verse 5 of Galatians 5 says, we and the writer of Galatians, which is the apostle Paul, includes himself in that we. He through the Spirit, waits for the hope of righteousness and says by faith. So we are waiting to enter heaven based upon faith in the finished work of Christ, but those that are counting on their works have fallen from grace and Christ will become of no effect of them.

And it says in verse 2, Christ will profit you nothing. Well, you know, without Christ you can’t enter heaven. Christ said, I am the way, I am the truth, I am the life. No man can come unto the Father but by me. That’s John 14 verse 6. So if you want to get to the Father, you have to go through Christ. If Christ counts nothing for you, my friend, you’ll never reach the Father. You’ll never go to heaven. You’ll be cast into the everlasting lake of fire.

I am pleading with you for your soul because I would not want you to go to hell. I remember a young man a number of years ago, he was saying that yes he trusted in Christ, but he also believed that he had to be water baptized to be saved. I said, you’re not saved. He said, yes, I am. I said, no, you’re not. He said, yes, I am. I said, no, you’re not. He said, yes, I am. I said, no, you’re not.

He said, why? I said, because you’ve added to what Christ did for you something that you could do of yourself. And if you add water baptism, church membership or whatever it might be, then Christ will count nothing for you. Well, anyway, he had difficulty seeing that, but after a point of time and going over scriptures, he saw it. He said, you know, you’re the first person who ever warned me that because I was trusting in things in addition to faith in Christ that I would be lost.

He says, I want to thank you. Nobody else has ever warned me. I thought, he said, that I was more secure, more safe, more likely to enter heaven, the more things I added to the list. But my friend, it’s not true. As soon as you add anything, then you have violated what God has offered to you. He offers us salvation by grace through faith. In Galatians 2.21 it says, I do not frustrate. The Greek word translated, frustrate in Galatians 2.21 means the thwart to nullify, to cancel, to make void, to make of none effect.

And it says there in Galatians 2, verse 21, I do not frustrate, make void, or nullify, or cancel, or thwart the grace of God, for if righteousness come by the law, or by works, then Christ is dead in vain. I had a friend of mine that lived down south of Tampa here, and he had a boat that he loved very dearly and he named his boat Galatians 221. I thought that was terrific. I said, how, why did you do that?

And he said, you know, I get in more conversations. He gets on the radio as he leaves the Docker coming into the dock and he’ll say Galatians 221, Galatians 221 to the, to the marina or to whoever, or whoever he’s communicating with. He said more people would ask you what does Galatians 221 mean, and he had a great opportunity to witness the people and say, it’s by grace through faith that you’re saved. I thought that was a wonderful idea, and I’ve never forgotten that.

Galatians 221, I do not frustrate, thwart, nullify, cancel, make void, make of none effect, the grace of God. If righteousness comes by the law or by works, then Christ is dead in vain. Wow, you don’t want to do that. As soon as you add any human work to the plan of salvation, my friend, you fort it, you frustrate it, you make it void, you cancel it, you make it of none effect. And that’s exactly what we’re reading in chapter 5 of Galatians, where it says Christ has become of no effect unto you.

Who is it speaking to? You who are justified by works, by the law. You are fallen from grace. In verse 5 it changes where Paul includes himself and says, but we, we through the Spirit, wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. What an interesting lesson here in rightly divided in order of truth. In verse 4 it’s speaking to the lost and it addresses them as you you you you you you in verse five it’s speaking to the same and it addresses them as we we we we so it’s very easy to pick this out once you see it but hopefully if you’re marking your Bible you’ll put next to verse four in Galatians five the lost in verse five the saved and you need to separate verses that are talking or dressing the lost from those verses that are addressing or talking to the same.

Are you in verse 4? Are you one of those that Christ will count nothing for you and you’ll wind up in hell even though you think you’re Christian, you think you’re on your way? I was raised that way that we were gaining new heights every day as we were on our upward way, trying to earn our way to heaven, climbing Sunshine Mountain. I heard that Jesus wanted me to be He had a son beam, I didn’t know how to be a son beam as a little kid, but I thought, well, if I could try, I’ll sure try to be a son beam for Jesus.

But I didn’t realize that that was all works and that salvation is not based on works. That’s why Christ left heaven. That’s why He came to the earth. That’s why He died. He died for you and me and paid our sin debt in full. I hope you’ve trusted Christ alone. And the moment you do, God saves you, you can do it right now. He could say, God on a sinner, I don’t understand much about the Bible, but I believe Jesus paid my sin debt in full by His death and shed blood.

I believe He was buried. I believe He rose again from the dead. I trust Him right now at this moment to save me, forgive me to be my Savior, to take away my sin, to give me the gift of eternal life. The moment you do that, God saves you and you receive eternal life. This is Bibleline. I’m Dr. Englund’s term. We’re gonna go to the phone lines and the phone number is 1-800-576-3771 we have rock in Tampa and rock welcome to Bibleline you’re on the air Hello Dr.

Hank, this is this rock and Tampa. Listen first of all I want to I want to commend you on on your calling what you’re doing for the Lord because being electric in myself and and you going to be an electric engineer takes a whole lot of knowledge but doing what you’re doing is is just just unbelievable I commend you for that. My question is is I was witnessing to a Jehovah witness. Kind of not me when he said that you know he’d be they don’t believe in the trinity he says well if if god if if jesus is god why did god have to tell him everything first of all i i need to i need to hang up and listen to it so i want to write this down so i can i got it out from good not and once again i commend you sir all right

thank you rock the answer is jesus christ is god but he’s also a man and we see There is that separation where Jesus became a man and as a man, he was dependent upon God as his Father just as you and I are. And so he is the God man. And in the verses that talk about our salvation, it focuses on the man Jesus because it was not God who died on the cross, but it was the man Jesus, the sinless man that became the the Lamb of God that I had to pay for our sins on the cross.

It tells us, for example in Hebrews 10, verse 10, by God’s will we are sanctified, that means to be made pure and holy, by the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. Verse 12 says that this man, which is speaking of Jesus, after he’d offered one sacrifice for sins forever, set down on the right hand of God. And so it focuses on the humanity of Christ as this man, this sinless man as Adam sin and brought sin upon the whole human race.

The Bible contrasts that and talks about there’s another man that was sinless who went to the cross and provided for us eternal life. There are numerous verses that give us this wonderful contrast. And it tells us, for example, in Romans 5 in verse 17, for if by one man’s offense death reigned by one, and that’s talking about Adam, much more they receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one Jesus Christ.

So here there are two federal heads. Adam the head of the human race and in Christ the head of God’s family and it says here and I’ll read this verse again and it’s a great one. In fact there’s about six or eight verses here that keep this contrast going for you. And if by one man’s offense death reigned by one that’s Adam, much more they would receive the abundance of grace and of the gift, and notice it speaks here of a gift, the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one Jesus Christ.

He goes on in verse 18 saying, therefore as by the offense of one that’s Adam, judgment came upon all men to condemnation, even so by the righteousness of one, referring to Jesus Christ, the free gift comes upon all men under justification of life. So basically Jesus Christ, when he prayed to the Father, was praying as a man and it was the man Jesus that died on the cross of calorie. The same time Jesus says that he is God. In John 1030 Jesus said I and my Father are one.

The Jewish people understood exactly what he meant by that. In John 1030 he said I and my Father are one. Then in John 1031 it says then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. Then Jesus says many good works that I showed you for my Father for which of those good works He is stoned me in verse 33. This is a powerful verse rock. It says In verse 33 the Jews answered him saying for a good work We stoned me not but for blasphemy and because of thou being a man Make us thyself God.

They knew his claim that Jesus was claiming to be God. I’d recommend the gospel of John to you It is one of the four gospels that focuses on the deity of Christ It begins in verse 1. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. So here we find that Jesus The second eternal member of the Godhead existed prior to the beginning. So in the beginning he already was. Then verse 14 says, and the word was made flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory.

So the word being made flesh was the incarnation which took place at Bethlehem when God came and took on a human body. in that little stable there in Bethlehem. He grew up and it says here in John 1.14 that John says we beheld His glory. The glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. Jesus was the only human that God ever began. He was sinless and perfect. of course, went to the cross. Later in that same chapter, John the Baptist sees Jesus and says, Behold the Lamb of God which takeeth away the sin of the world.

So hopefully that helps a little bit and thank you, Rock, for your call. We now have Brad in Clearwater, Florida. Brad, welcome to Bibleline. Good morning, Pastor Lindstrom. Good morning. the two things going to be a tish ray one fifty seven sixty seven and uh… but i don’t know my geography that well i was wondering if america is going to is the uh… last time so i’m that uh… gets russia shana listen to your response by radio all right you know i i really don’t know uh…

about the being the last time so i would not suspect so uh… you know when you when you if you were to take it that gee i’m assuming you’re talking about jesus returning And if he comes at a particular time in Israel, then whether you move forward or backward as far as the time zones going left or right around the earth, I really don’t know which would be first or last. And I don’t think it makes a bit of difference because actually it’s the same point in time and the difference being what it would read on the clock in your time zone.

Because we’re on the air right now for example in Memphis, Tennessee live. But it’s 922 in Memphis, but it’s 1022 here in Tampa. And so obviously we’re talking about the same point in time, but reading on the clock it’ll be different because of the times on your end. We’ll just have to wait and see it all. It all plays out Brad. Thanks for the question. We now have Mark. Mark is in the new porridge and mark welcome to Bibleline your own the air Hello dr.

Hank. Yeah, I love your ministry. It’s really helped my wife and myself and I walk with God and Do you have a question for you? We’ve been attending the same church now for several years and I’m going some changes I we threw my wife and I were both brought up Catholics and we’ve left because of the man-made laws and We’re more into the Bible and following strict. You know your your ministry has really helped us understand the Bible wonder where we want to be they have a new possible period and they’ve been a one of the chief any of the corporate quickly one is that uh…

we we need to in the other one talks about our military and though i think that uh… obviously they’re becoming uh… some of those tree huggers are out there you know roman’s chapter one it it warns about how people would love the creation more than the creator And the focus would be on the creation rather than the one who created the world and the universe and all the things that are in it. Plus certainly the Bible does not tell us not to have armies but we certainly have every country has the right to have to defend themselves and to have a military force.

It sounds like they are saying things and causing the church to affirm them things that are really contrary to Bible doctrine. What would you do in this situation? I don’t think you knew much. You can appeal and see if they would recognize that and rescind it or you might have to leave. It’s very difficult to change the church from the bottom up because the leadership have to to be. In agreement and you can appeal to them and ask them to say hey would you reconsider this doesn’t sound very biblical to your homework and Present a case, but if they don’t then I think you just have to look for a sound church Because it needs to be sound from the top to the bottom If you don’t have good elders deacons and a good pastor who?

Obviously embraces the Bible and takes it literally and teaches and proclaims it then you’ve got problems in general account that you can’t change it for Thank you for calling in and we are glad to be able to be with you today and we are about ready to go to our break time. We have more people waiting but we’re going to probably have to make them wait till after the break because the time is so close to break that we would not be able to get a question really answered.

We have a number of waiting callers waiting to get a free line here and we have a number of questions. And we have some offer questions we want to deal with but if you haven’t trusted Jesus as your Savior Let me encourage you to just whisper that prayer right now between you and the living God Just tell him God I’m a sinner But I trust Jesus as my Savior as the one who died and shed his blood so that I might be forgiven And I trust that he died for me and was buried and rose again from the dead And I trust him to forgive my sin and to give me the gift of eternal life and he will we’re going to break We’ll be right back.

Keep your radio down to right where it is. I’m dr. England’s room and stay tuned Don’t go away Bibleline. We’ll be back in a moment. Give us a call at 1-800-576-3771 That’s 1-800-576-3771 Well, I’m dr. England’s room. It’s great to be with you. This is Friday I hope you’ll attend church some places this weekend and the way to pick a church is not by the architecture or by the size or by location, but rather by what are they teaching?

Because the bottom line is, are they proclaiming God’s Word? Is the gospel correct? And are they leading people to Christ? Are people being challenged to live for Christ? That’s the kind of church that you’ll want to attend. Then we have a sheet here that you can call and ask and request, call beliefs that matter. That’s kind of a brief summary on about 25 doctrines that a good-sound church ought to believe if you want to unite with that church. So you might want to consider calling and asking for us to send that sheet out to you about beliefs that matter.

I hope that you’ve trusted the word as your Savior. If you haven’t, you need to not put that off, but you need to trust the Lord as the only means of your salvation. As we spoke today about how if you add anything plus Christ, you get a big zero, no salvation at all. Christ becomes of no effect to those that are trusting in any works in addition to faith in Christ. You have to come to the place where you realize that you’re lost, unable to save yourself, that the only way to be saved is to trust in the finished work of Jesus Christ at the cross.

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We’re going to do the second half of Bibleline. We’re ready to rejoin stations that have been on break. If your station doesn’t carry the second half go to the internet and you’ll catch the the full program, but get ready. We’re ready now to do the second half of Bibleline, and stay tuned right where you are. Would you like to call Bibleline and ask Dr. Lindstrom a question? You can. Just pick up your phone and dial 1-800-576-3771. Now here again is Dr.

Hank Lindstrom. We’re back from that break. This is Bible. I’m straight to be with you today. Thanks for tuning in. We’re coming to you live from Tampa, Florida from our studios at the Calvary Community Church. We’re on the pastor and we look forward to being with you each and every day. We go directly from our studios here at Calvary Community Church to Detroit, Michigan, where we are then Then take it, the signal is taken and put up on the satellite that orbits the Earth at 22,500 miles above the equator.

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We’re going to go down to Jeff in Venice, Florida. Jeff, welcome to Bibleline. How are you doing, Dr. Hank? Good. Very much for taking my call. I’m calling in reference to your first caller. I had the conversation with the Jehovah’s Witness. Yes. And just a couple things to add if you don’t mind. He really needs to address that issue as a headship issue because if we look at God the Father and Jesus being in a chain of command just in a head and in a headship issue, it only makes sense to take price being by very nature.

God did not hold equality with God, would be taking his commands and receiving his information from God the Father. And also that’s a very good opportunity to prove Christ’s deity also because if Jesus was indeed just man as the Jehovah Witnesses claim then how did he go sinless seeing how none of us are righteous at all. So I just wanted to add those two things and I thank you very much. Well it’s very good. Thank you Jeff and appreciate your listening and sharing with us today.

That’s right on. We’re now going to go to Gary down in Bradenton, Florida, and Gary, welcome to Bibleline. Good morning. I can barely hear you for some reason. Oh, I’m sorry. But in any event, I’ll have to go outside here in Holler. Maybe you’ll hear me down there in Bradenton. Just to continue our discussion about salvation, the doctrine of salvation, and but real briefly, the gentleman, you know, since obviously the Trinity obviously is another hot topic, that gentleman who’s going to take on a Jehovah’s Witness who’s probably been studying the Scriptures for years, he’s going to have a difficult time just to go in with a few Scriptures.

I think he needs to spend a lot of time studying this issue before even attempts to take on a Jehovah’s Witness. what the hope we he’s he’s well researched and well read uh… before he takes on that task uh… vice uh… my just to continue our discussion and this is going to be a new aspect of this uh… i i hope you haven’t been interpreting anything i’ve said on the doctrine of heber six and heber ten as to that works get you uh…

saved i hope that the case that the case well i wasn’t really sure but i’m glad you’re making a statement and i say by works and uh… right and i also believe we’re not kept by works you know well and and he but i don’t think we’re kept by work either and that’s why i think it’s important to to distinguish it because of all your paperwork and on your cd you keep using that work uh… argument as an example to defeat that you know this other interpretation and it’s not the work that you can lose your salvation it’s not that belief it’s not the work it’s not the belief that lack of confidence that he bears uh…

talks about and uh… to the fact that it takes belief to get you into heaven or state it can take non-belief that’s not a work when we say non-belief because if you say it the work then you’re saying to work to believe to get you the salvation so i just want to make clear on that point Now, one thing I wanted to kind of touch on, you mentioned the gentleman on your CD, and I think you mentioned today the same individual, that he believed that if he could lose his salvation based on his works, which is not what I’m saying, but that he is not saved.

So when we talk about knowing for sure one salvation, so not only do you believe one has to repent and believe Jesus died for their sins and rose again on the third day. They also have to believe at that moment in time to know for sure their salvation that works has nothing to do with it. Is that your position? Well, I believe you have to come to the place where you recognize your works will not save you and place your trust in Christ as the only alternative to save you and God saves you.

but the reason okay but now when you add that into it and say that their salvation is dependent upon it most people the issue doesn’t even come up in and when asking someone to repent of their sin and believe that jesus and died in rose again and if you have to instruct them on this additional doctrine which can be very complex of the which i think you are last uh… you know few days here and discussing this it really uh…

put it at the p without really uh… if they have to believe in that additional thing, I don’t know, I think if you say someone believes they repent and believe Jesus died and rose again, but they don’t even know about this other issue and you’re saying well unless they know about it they aren’t sure I think that position and now just to touch briefly on this knowing for sure. Let me just say just the issue of being saved all together you you have to recognize that you are helpless to save yourself if you reach out to a If you’re drowning, obviously you realize you’ve got yourself in a fix, in a pickle, and you need help.

And you obviously need that lifeguard or whatever to save you in the same way. When you come to the place where you realize that you need help, obviously you’re not looking to yourself to save you. You’re looking to that savior to save you. And so it’s implied that our works have nothing to do with it right from the get-go. Well, yeah, I think it’s fair to say that work has nothing to do with one salvation, but non-belief I think comes into play after the fact, and I think that’s what Hebrews is talking about.

So one knowing for sure that they are saved at day one, because at the Gershaun-Salman Conference you had indicated, or you said, that if one continued to sin and willfully did it and maybe they weren’t originally saved which kind of undercuts your whole thing of knowing for sure to begin with. Well you could do that but the point is that if you do that without any consequences it would prove your unsafe because God promises that he would discipline anyone who is delinquent He was a believer in Christ, because in Hebrews 12 8 it says, where he tells us about every believer being chastened, that if you are without his chastisement or discipline, where all of his children are partakers, it says you are bastard and not a son.

If you could live as you please, violating God’s principles and laws in his word, without any consequences in your life, then it would demonstrate that you are not his because as a father, he will discipline every son that he receives according to Hebrews 12-6. So you can’t get away with it and for someone to be able to live a life where apparently they are getting away with living as they please, it would only demonstrate that they are not saved.

What would you say to the believer that you brought to Christ personally and then 20 years later they come to you and say doctor and by the way when you brought them to cry you and that person was in agreement that they knew for sure they were saved and they came to you twenty years later and said you know what doctor i don’t believe anymore and i’m gonna sin will fully what would you tell that person where they still saved well i would have to tell them if they are they’re not going to get away with that the Lord is going to stank them or discipline them maybe take a moment of heaven early but uh…

if they uh… are not saved and obviously they’ll they’ll get away with that though though until a guy and they’ll be cast in the house force but they knew but under this question you said they knew one can know for sure if you are saved at the time one and say you know that is here or but then twenty years later they say i don’t believe anymore and i think willfully and then your responses will then maybe you aren’t safe to begin with will then that undercut that they really can’t know for sure.

Well, not really because Peter talks about the believer that doesn’t grow and add to his Christian life as he begins his Christian life. There are seven things that a little recipe that Peter has that we ought to do as a believer that if we don’t do them, then it says in 2 Peter chapter 1 verse 9, he that lack of these things which are sevenfold here is blind and cannot see a faff and then it says hath forgotten, hath forgotten that he was saved, hath forgotten that he was purged from his sins.

So a person can get to the place where they forget. They can get away from the Lord to the place as a believer and forget that they were saved and here Peter talks about the consequences of that and the loss of reward and eternity and the fact that they lose out on the joy of having an insurance and i think that’s what peter’s talking about well then why at the gersham salman conference would you tell me that individual maybe wasn’t saved originally well it’s a possibility i mean we talk about a person is either saver loss so even may not have ever been saved there are people who just do live service for whatever reason uh…

to just maybe to be accepted in a group and they’ll say yeah i believe whatever you believe. And I’ve seen that happen where a person, maybe after several years, it doesn’t happen very often. But they’ll say, wow, I finally understand it. It’s like the light turns on and all of a sudden they say, I haven’t been a believer for these several years. And I said all the right things to fit in here, but now I truly understand and have trusted the Lord.

So that’s a possibility. So obviously we don’t see inside somebody’s head, we just have to listen to their responses and judge whether they’re telling the truth or whether this is for real or whether they’re masquerading as a believer when they’re not really one. Obviously, the bottom line is that God makes that determination. If you’re a believer masquerading as a believer and you try to live as you please, God will not be chasing you it says he will chase in every son and if you’re not chasing then you’re a bastard you’re not a son at all you just the creating I’m referring to people though that do sincerely believe originally and then fall from that belief and don’t believe anymore so thank you doctor I appreciate it well it’s been fun talking to Gary Gary is obviously stimulating all of our thought thinking here and and

I hope you’ll listen as I I’m sure Gary will be back and we’ll carry this discussion even further. We have Lawrence in parish Florida. Lawrence, welcome to my line. You’re on the air. Hello, Dr. Hank. Yeah, Lawrence. Yes. It’s a joy to hear you. Well, thank you. And the reason for my call is I’m responding to Gary. Gary seems to call just about every day. And as far as the Bible teacher you are about is found and is accurate on the scriptures.

Is anybody I’ve ever heard? And it seems like Gary is very argumentative. I hope he’s still listening. And he’s, he’s, seems like he’s trying to pick apart your teaching. And I can’t quite figure out where he’s coming from, what is the agenda is, even what his denomination might be, I can’t quite figure it out. Well, I think in my personal conversation with him is he claims he’s not a believer. And he’s not a believer. No, he claims he is not a believer.

He might correct me when he calls again. but he claimed to me that he’s not a believer and is not a member of any organized group at all i was wondering if he’s one of these groups that uh… you know have bible no i think he is uh… not connected with any particular group uh… but i think uh… that uh… he’s obviously uh… uh… well read and he’s articulate but i think he’s uh… obviously not comprehending yet what we’re talking about here at the extent that he’s come over uh…

to believe it and embrace it i i i pray that gary would would come online with this and trust the law to be assured of going to have himself that’s what he’s arguing just because i think he’s like everyday called up and i think he’s about to let well you absolutely write about that and uh… i’d just like to make a few comments in the day of judge and they claim all all these wonderful things that they have done in his name.

They said the poor and give water to those that are thirsty and all this. Jesus said, depart from the work from ye, ye workers of iniquity, I never knew you and has lost their stuff. We just could never say in the Gospel, Dr. Lajan and the verses are just, I know them, but I just can’t remember the reference that we… That we are held, we are not holding on to Jesus. Jesus is holding us in His hand. And the Father is holding us also in His hand.

It’s not us clinging on to Jesus. Jesus is Jesus holding us in our hand, in his hand. And I am talked to people that claim you can lose your salvation and you can. and you can talk to have you, you cannot convince them. It’s about like talking to a Jehovah’s Witness. And Yuri’s got a good heart and maybe, but it seems like he’s calling And to throw doubts upon your teaching. And I wish Gary would just reconsider, you know, what he is doing.

You know, you’ve got a wonderful work here trying to reach people, trying to reach them with the gospel message. He’s trying to get people saved. And the purpose of the program is not to carry on this continuous argument about a theory that he is wrong in. And he’s, you know, I know you went to college and you’ve probably taken Geometry in algebra. And, you know, when you go, and I took Geometry way back when I was in high school.

and I really haven’t touched it since, but I know I think it’s called Axiums and Theorems that you’ve got to learn at the beginning of the book in the list. Later on, you use these things that you learned in the beginning of the book to solve these difficult verses in Hebrews. You have to take the whole Bible. You have to weigh these verses against other scriptures, many other scriptures. And if you read ten commentaries, you’re going to get ten different, which I have.

You’re going to get ten different opinions of these verses. And you know, to argue about this day after day after day, and you know, you… He’s not going to change your mind because you’re right. Thank you for that assessment as a listener and I think it was good. Thank you very much. I got the same. Well, thank you Lord. My pleasure goes up. And finally I felt like I just had to respond. Well thank you for that assessment as a listener and I think it was good.

Thank you very much. Okay. Thank you Dr. Hank. He does very well come to Bible and. Hey Dr. Hank I can just barely hear you I was just gonna. The guy that called ahead of me there kind of took care of what I had to say I just want to let Gary know that this is the Bibleline and he’s not really your co-host and. We lost that call somehow and Steve sorry about that but thank you somehow you got cut off.

Anyway, this is Bible and the phone number is 1-800-576-3771 and we invite you to give us a call and get in on the program. We have several here that have left off-air questions. Let me take one of them, Frank, in Clearwater calls in. He said he is a friend that’s reading the Quran and is very confused. Well, I can understand why because I think if you read the Quran, you’re going to get confused. In one place it says God created the earth in six days, and in other places it says He created the earth in eight days, and they just, it has contradictions in it.

It’s not like the Bible which does not have contradictions in it. He says here, Frank says it from Clearwater, he saw a NASA scientist on the Discovery Channel that had said that the Corinne is a supernatural book that could not have been written by men. What do you think about this? I think it is a supernatural book, but I think that Satan is the author of the Koran. When you read the history, Mohammed would go into these transits, he’d go into these caves and go into these states of ecstasy, and he said he would see these genies that would talk to him, and they gave him the message.

And I think they were demons myself. And the message is really a plagiarism, first of all, of the Scriptures, Old and the Testament Clotetry in the Quran, and then a twisting and a rejection of the death-bare resurrection of Christ and the deity of Christ. And obviously just making Jesus one more of 40,000 prophets that the people of Islam accept. In any case, I think it is supernatural, and probably didn’t come from Muhammad’s head either. It was given to him by demonic forces, but it’s not from God.

So I reject the Quran as being the word of God. The Bible is the only book that really not only makes the claim, but demonstrates so by its accuracy, by the fact that it doesn’t contradict itself, the fact that it tells the future and the fact that it is rooted in history where you can confirm the prophecies and demonstrate to this book really is what it claims to be the Word of God. So Frank, thank you for that author question and hopefully we have been able to take care of that.

In Revelation it says, Christ and Tampa calls in and says it talks about 12 disciples sitting on the throne in Matthew chapter 19. Who are the twelve disciples? Is Judas 1 or Matthias or Paul? I think Paul has to be the twelve one. Judas went to hell so he won’t be sitting on any throne ruling in the future. He’s going to be separated from God forever because Judas was never a believer. But Matthias was not elected legitimately. God never told Peter to elect anybody and Peter was out of God’s will.

He was told to wait and there’s 10 days between the Ascension and the day of Pentecost and he didn’t wait. And so obviously he was out of order there and Paul has to be the one that would replace him. So I believe the twelve disciples sitting on thrones during the Millennial Kingdom will be the eleven minus Judas but Paul taking the place of Judas. Hopefully that helps there.

Ryan in St. Petersburg calls in and asks about the word perish. In John 3 16 it says, this whoever believed in Christ should not perish but have everlasting life. It speaks about death. And I believe the total payment for sin is not only physical death but also spiritual death. Where you are at physical death separated from your body but in spiritual death you are separated from God’s presence forever in hell. Well, we’re out of time here. It looks like the program has come to an end, and we hope that you’ll join us again on Monday, and hopefully you’ll attend church someplace this weekend.

Keep looking up. Jesus is coming. Don’t go away. Bibleline will be back in a moment. Give us a call at 1-800-576-3771. That’s 1-800-576-3771. Alright, we’ve enjoyed bringing Bible-M-T today and I hope that you’ve enjoyed it. We had a glitch with our equipment here where the ending of the program didn’t come off as smooth as we’d like to, but we are glad that we were able to be with you and we hope that you’ll pray for us and we hope that you’ll recognize our need and maybe give a regular gift of Bible and we count on our listeners to be a regular part of the program by assisting us to be able to pay the bills to get us on the air.

And maybe you might want to consider doing that. Don’t forget our internet site. We have lots of resources for you to look at. We hope that you’ll take a look at the online bookstore that we have. Also go to the streaming where you can catch our radio and television programs and enjoy those. Also, we hope that you’ll maybe take a look at the many other things we have on our website. There’s so many things I can’t even keep up with it.

But you can read the scriptures and they actually have them read to you on the scriptures, which is exciting. In any case, thank you for tuning in today. We appreciate all of our listeners and want you to know that we would love to get a chance to meet you. sometime if you ever get a chance to come by and visit our resource center or come to a worship service here in Tampa at the Calvary Community Church if you ever come into town.

We’d love to have you be a part of that by coming by and visiting with us and saying hi and we’ll get a chance to meet you and you’ll get a chance to meet us and that’ll be great. But otherwise we’ll meet you in heaven if you’re a believer and if you’re not a believer then you need to trust Jesus as your Savior and receive that wonderful gift of everlasting life. There is only one way to enter heaven and that is through Christ and unless you trust Him you will never, never enter into the presence of God.

Christ said, I am the way the truth of life and no man comes unto the Father but by me. I hope you have trusted the Lord as your Savior and we’ll see you there in Heaven. Don’t forget to give us a call. We’d love to hear from you. The number is 1-800-576-3771. That’s 1-800-576-3771. And we’re going to have to run, but we’ll be back again on Monday. And in the meantime, we have a great weekend. I hope you attend church someplace and make plans to join us again on Monday here on Bible and of course on the Internet you could join us all week in long.

God bless, have a great weekend. Keep looking up. Jesus is coming and I believe very, very soon. Would you like to call Bibleline and ask Dr. Lynch from a question? You can. Just pick up your phone and dial 1-800-576-3771 that’s 1-800-576-3771. Now here again is Dr. Hank Lindstrom.